I don't think both Mods "jumped" on to you with any purpose other than to address your points as animation fans! I only came back into the fray to back myself up after you argued against what I had said before. But...whatever...slate wiped, let's start again clean.
So...Kung Fu Panda...despite the safe celebrity voices, I actually think DWs has something fairly new for them. I'm hoping it won't <I>just</I> be stuffed with martial arts film references or be what Shark Tale was to mafia movies.
Kung Fu Panda
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I too hope that it doesn't in any way resemble "Shark Tale" (artistically or in any other way) but I'm encouraged by the following quote by Jerry Beck from Cartoon Brew.
I saw Kung Fu Panda several weeks ago and have been raving about it since. It's excellent in every way, in every department. The hand drawn animation sequence opens the picture in a spectacular way. It's a stylized anime graphic piece. Bravo to all at Dreamworks - every decision made on this picture was correct and it will be huge in theatres this summer.
animationguildblog.blogspot.com/2008/05/dreamworks-of-west.html
I saw Kung Fu Panda several weeks ago and have been raving about it since. It's excellent in every way, in every department. The hand drawn animation sequence opens the picture in a spectacular way. It's a stylized anime graphic piece. Bravo to all at Dreamworks - every decision made on this picture was correct and it will be huge in theatres this summer.
animationguildblog.blogspot.com/2008/05/dreamworks-of-west.html
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Well,Dreamworks seems to more think about... let's say... the stars who voices the characters and etc.
Also I think that the new films seems to try attracting more small children then all ages (Unlike Disney),I"m not saying they're childish but think about the ideas of Cars and Kung Fu Panda-A panda who learn kung fu and talking cars,whouldn't small children like those ideas? (And I"m not saying that only them likes it),you see my point?.
Also I think that the new films seems to try attracting more small children then all ages (Unlike Disney),I"m not saying they're childish but think about the ideas of Cars and Kung Fu Panda-A panda who learn kung fu and talking cars,whouldn't small children like those ideas? (And I"m not saying that only them likes it),you see my point?.
[img]http://i43.tinypic.com/bfqbtk.jpg[/img]
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OK....here's basically my feelings on DW.
I don't think that the DreamWorks we see today is the DreamWorks that Jeffrey Katenberg originally envisioned back in 1994. If you read early articles from say, 1996, 97, 98, you could tell that he was very, very much enamored with 2d animation, yes, even then, and was actually quite devoted to making "epics" of the sort he did at Disney. Perhaps not always AS successfully (although perhaps it's a matter of opinion) but movies like Spirit, POE and Sinbad were from his heart.
Madagascar, Shark Tale, and Over the Hedge--much less so.
The truth of the matter is that he was just too caught up in competing with Disney, and the art was compromised. (sad and painful truth.
)
He said back in 2002 that he would always love 2d but "I could see it wasn't the future." No, it just wasn't what was making money at the time. Pixar's movies were. So--Pixar, and thus CGI, was the future. (again sad and painful to admit.) I think A LOT more traditional movies were in the pipeline at DW that just never got underway or saw the light of day because of this. Remember Tusker? Remember "The Whale" (Moby Dick update or something.) Remember "Truckers, Diggers and Wings"? There was also one about space age firefighters if I'm not mistaken. Can't remember what it was called but it was definitely in the pipeline back in the late 90s. As was that Noah DTV--such a shame. I think DW would have been MUCH stronger had they (OK, JK) stuck to the original template and not abandoned it so they could compete with Pixar. Again, this is painful to admit--but IMHO, true.
Sinbad was originally much darker, as was El Dorado, as was Spirit (if I'm not mistaken.) But riskier, and thus not what ultimately got made. I think the reason POE is probably the "best" out of the traditional DW films is that they weren't afraid to try new things, (albeit with the blessing of religious groups, but still.) And then, of course, POE did decent but nowhere near what they wanted, and, as we remember, did not capture the attention of the Oscars other than "Best Song." So....El Dorado and Sinbad went from being daring to much more conventional--even with flashes of what I would consider brilliance.
Spielberg asked JK WAYYYYYYYY back in 1994 what kind of animated movies he'd like to make. And JK said, sci-films, T2 type films, Lawrence of Arabia type films, only in animation. (And of course Spielberg suggested that "you do The Ten Commandments") That was the original plan but....reality intervened.
I don't think that the DreamWorks we see today is the DreamWorks that Jeffrey Katenberg originally envisioned back in 1994. If you read early articles from say, 1996, 97, 98, you could tell that he was very, very much enamored with 2d animation, yes, even then, and was actually quite devoted to making "epics" of the sort he did at Disney. Perhaps not always AS successfully (although perhaps it's a matter of opinion) but movies like Spirit, POE and Sinbad were from his heart.
Madagascar, Shark Tale, and Over the Hedge--much less so.
) Ditto Antz, you could feel the investment that was put in that. But it doesn't resonate nearly as much with Mad, ST or OTH. ESPECIALLY now that DW has been bought by Paramount/Nick.
The truth of the matter is that he was just too caught up in competing with Disney, and the art was compromised. (sad and painful truth.
)He said back in 2002 that he would always love 2d but "I could see it wasn't the future." No, it just wasn't what was making money at the time. Pixar's movies were. So--Pixar, and thus CGI, was the future. (again sad and painful to admit.) I think A LOT more traditional movies were in the pipeline at DW that just never got underway or saw the light of day because of this. Remember Tusker? Remember "The Whale" (Moby Dick update or something.) Remember "Truckers, Diggers and Wings"? There was also one about space age firefighters if I'm not mistaken. Can't remember what it was called but it was definitely in the pipeline back in the late 90s. As was that Noah DTV--such a shame. I think DW would have been MUCH stronger had they (OK, JK) stuck to the original template and not abandoned it so they could compete with Pixar. Again, this is painful to admit--but IMHO, true.
Sinbad was originally much darker, as was El Dorado, as was Spirit (if I'm not mistaken.) But riskier, and thus not what ultimately got made. I think the reason POE is probably the "best" out of the traditional DW films is that they weren't afraid to try new things, (albeit with the blessing of religious groups, but still.) And then, of course, POE did decent but nowhere near what they wanted, and, as we remember, did not capture the attention of the Oscars other than "Best Song." So....El Dorado and Sinbad went from being daring to much more conventional--even with flashes of what I would consider brilliance.
Spielberg asked JK WAYYYYYYYY back in 1994 what kind of animated movies he'd like to make. And JK said, sci-films, T2 type films, Lawrence of Arabia type films, only in animation. (And of course Spielberg suggested that "you do The Ten Commandments") That was the original plan but....reality intervened.
You can’t just have your characters announce how they feel! That makes me feel angry!
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OK....here's basically my feelings on DW. Wink
I don't think that the DreamWorks we see today is the DreamWorks that Jeffrey Katenberg originally envisioned back in 1994. If you read early articles from say, 1996, 97, 98, you could tell that he was very, very much enamored with 2d animation, yes, even then, and was actually quite devoted to making "epics" of the sort he did at Disney. Perhaps not always AS successfully (although perhaps it's a matter of opinion) but movies like Spirit, POE and Sinbad were from his heart.
Madagascar, Shark Tale, and Over the Hedge--much less so.
Click to reveal hidden content
The only other film I think came close was Shrek, (Shrek 2 was good as well, though less risky) because it was DARING because it was so subversive. (at least back in 2001, anyway. Confused) Ditto Antz, you could feel the investment that was put in that. But it doesn't resonate nearly as much with Mad, ST or OTH. ESPECIALLY now that DW has been bought by Paramount/Nick.
The truth of the matter is that he was just too caught up in competing with Disney, and the art was compromised. (sad and painful truth. Sad )
He said back in 2002 that he would always love 2d but "I could see it wasn't the future." No, it just wasn't what was making money at the time. Pixar's movies were. So--Pixar, and thus CGI, was the future. (again sad and painful to admit.) I think A LOT more traditional movies were in the pipeline at DW that just never got underway or saw the light of day because of this. Remember Tusker? Remember "The Whale" (Moby Dick update or something.) Remember "Truckers, Diggers and Wings"? There was also one about space age firefighters if I'm not mistaken. Can't remember what it was called but it was definitely in the pipeline back in the late 90s. As was that Noah DTV--such a shame. I think DW would have been MUCH stronger had they (OK, JK) stuck to the original template and not abandoned it so they could compete with Pixar. Again, this is painful to admit--but IMHO, true.
Sinbad was originally much darker, as was El Dorado, as was Spirit (if I'm not mistaken.) But riskier, and thus not what ultimately got made. I think the reason POE is probably the "best" out of the traditional DW films is that they weren't afraid to try new things, (albeit with the blessing of religious groups, but still.) And then, of course, POE did decent but nowhere near what they wanted, and, as we remember, did not capture the attention of the Oscars other than "Best Song." So....El Dorado and Sinbad went from being daring to much more conventional--even with flashes of what I would consider brilliance.
Spielberg asked JK WAYYYYYYYY back in 1994 what kind of animated movies he'd like to make. And JK said, sci-films, T2 type films, Lawrence of Arabia type films, only in animation. (And of course Spielberg suggested that "you do The Ten Commandments") That was the original plan but....reality intervened. Sad
I don't think that the DreamWorks we see today is the DreamWorks that Jeffrey Katenberg originally envisioned back in 1994. If you read early articles from say, 1996, 97, 98, you could tell that he was very, very much enamored with 2d animation, yes, even then, and was actually quite devoted to making "epics" of the sort he did at Disney. Perhaps not always AS successfully (although perhaps it's a matter of opinion) but movies like Spirit, POE and Sinbad were from his heart.
Madagascar, Shark Tale, and Over the Hedge--much less so.
Click to reveal hidden content
The only other film I think came close was Shrek, (Shrek 2 was good as well, though less risky) because it was DARING because it was so subversive. (at least back in 2001, anyway. Confused) Ditto Antz, you could feel the investment that was put in that. But it doesn't resonate nearly as much with Mad, ST or OTH. ESPECIALLY now that DW has been bought by Paramount/Nick.
The truth of the matter is that he was just too caught up in competing with Disney, and the art was compromised. (sad and painful truth. Sad )
He said back in 2002 that he would always love 2d but "I could see it wasn't the future." No, it just wasn't what was making money at the time. Pixar's movies were. So--Pixar, and thus CGI, was the future. (again sad and painful to admit.) I think A LOT more traditional movies were in the pipeline at DW that just never got underway or saw the light of day because of this. Remember Tusker? Remember "The Whale" (Moby Dick update or something.) Remember "Truckers, Diggers and Wings"? There was also one about space age firefighters if I'm not mistaken. Can't remember what it was called but it was definitely in the pipeline back in the late 90s. As was that Noah DTV--such a shame. I think DW would have been MUCH stronger had they (OK, JK) stuck to the original template and not abandoned it so they could compete with Pixar. Again, this is painful to admit--but IMHO, true.
Sinbad was originally much darker, as was El Dorado, as was Spirit (if I'm not mistaken.) But riskier, and thus not what ultimately got made. I think the reason POE is probably the "best" out of the traditional DW films is that they weren't afraid to try new things, (albeit with the blessing of religious groups, but still.) And then, of course, POE did decent but nowhere near what they wanted, and, as we remember, did not capture the attention of the Oscars other than "Best Song." So....El Dorado and Sinbad went from being daring to much more conventional--even with flashes of what I would consider brilliance.
Spielberg asked JK WAYYYYYYYY back in 1994 what kind of animated movies he'd like to make. And JK said, sci-films, T2 type films, Lawrence of Arabia type films, only in animation. (And of course Spielberg suggested that "you do The Ten Commandments") That was the original plan but....reality intervened. Sad
You can’t just have your characters announce how they feel! That makes me feel angry!
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OK....here's basically my feelings on DW. 
I don't think that the DreamWorks we see today is in any way the DreamWorks that Jeffrey Katenberg originally envisioned back in 1994. If you read early articles from say, 1996, 97, 98, you could tell that he was very, very much enamored with 2d animation, yes, even then, and was actually quite devoted to making "epics" of the sort he did at Disney. Perhaps not always AS successfully (although perhaps it's a matter of opinion) but movies like Spirit, POE and Sinbad were from his heart.
Madagascar, Shark Tale, and Over the Hedge--much less so.
The truth of the matter is that he was just too caught up in competing with Disney, and the art was compromised. (sad and painful truth.)
He said back in 2004 that he would always love 2d but "I could see it wasn't the future." No, it just wasn't what was making money at the time. Pixar's movies were. So--Pixar, and thus CGI, was the future. (again sad and painful to admit.) I think A LOT more traditional movies were in the pipeline at DW that just never got underway or saw the light of day because of this. Remember Tusker? Remember "The Whale" (Moby Dick update or something.) Remember "Truckers, Diggers and Wings"? There was also one about space age firefighters if I'm not mistaken. Can't remember what it was called but it was definitely in the pipeline back in the late 90s. As was that Noah DTV--such a shame. I think DW would have been MUCH stronger had they (OK, JK) stuck to the original template and not abandoned it so they could compete with Pixar. Again, this is painful to admit--but IMHO, true.
Sinbad was originally much darker, (Proteus was good/evil) as was El Dorado (I think Miguel was supposed to die!) , as was Spirit. But riskier, and thus not what ultimately got made. I think the reason POE is probably the "best" out of the traditional DW films is that they weren't afraid to try new things, (albeit with the blessing, no pun intended, of religious groups, but still.) And then, of course, POE did decent but nowhere near what they wanted, and, as we remember, did not capture the attention of the Oscars other than "Best Song." So....El Dorado and Sinbad went from being daring to much more conventional--even with flashes of what I would consider real brilliance. (Whatever else you want to say, the sirens scene in Sinbad and the opening credits of El Dorado were simply breathtakiing--very reminiscent of the "hyroglyphics/flashback" scene in POE.)
Spielberg asked JK WAYYYYYYYY back in 1994 what kind of animated movies he'd like to make. And JK said, sci-films, T2 type films, Lawrence of Arabia type films, only in animation. (And of course Spielberg suggested that "you do The Ten Commandments") That was the original plan but....reality intervened.
I don't think that the DreamWorks we see today is in any way the DreamWorks that Jeffrey Katenberg originally envisioned back in 1994. If you read early articles from say, 1996, 97, 98, you could tell that he was very, very much enamored with 2d animation, yes, even then, and was actually quite devoted to making "epics" of the sort he did at Disney. Perhaps not always AS successfully (although perhaps it's a matter of opinion) but movies like Spirit, POE and Sinbad were from his heart.
Madagascar, Shark Tale, and Over the Hedge--much less so.
The truth of the matter is that he was just too caught up in competing with Disney, and the art was compromised. (sad and painful truth.
)He said back in 2004 that he would always love 2d but "I could see it wasn't the future." No, it just wasn't what was making money at the time. Pixar's movies were. So--Pixar, and thus CGI, was the future. (again sad and painful to admit.) I think A LOT more traditional movies were in the pipeline at DW that just never got underway or saw the light of day because of this. Remember Tusker? Remember "The Whale" (Moby Dick update or something.) Remember "Truckers, Diggers and Wings"? There was also one about space age firefighters if I'm not mistaken. Can't remember what it was called but it was definitely in the pipeline back in the late 90s. As was that Noah DTV--such a shame. I think DW would have been MUCH stronger had they (OK, JK) stuck to the original template and not abandoned it so they could compete with Pixar. Again, this is painful to admit--but IMHO, true.
Sinbad was originally much darker, (Proteus was good/evil) as was El Dorado (I think Miguel was supposed to die!) , as was Spirit. But riskier, and thus not what ultimately got made. I think the reason POE is probably the "best" out of the traditional DW films is that they weren't afraid to try new things, (albeit with the blessing, no pun intended, of religious groups, but still.) And then, of course, POE did decent but nowhere near what they wanted, and, as we remember, did not capture the attention of the Oscars other than "Best Song." So....El Dorado and Sinbad went from being daring to much more conventional--even with flashes of what I would consider real brilliance. (Whatever else you want to say, the sirens scene in Sinbad and the opening credits of El Dorado were simply breathtakiing--very reminiscent of the "hyroglyphics/flashback" scene in POE.)
Spielberg asked JK WAYYYYYYYY back in 1994 what kind of animated movies he'd like to make. And JK said, sci-films, T2 type films, Lawrence of Arabia type films, only in animation. (And of course Spielberg suggested that "you do The Ten Commandments") That was the original plan but....reality intervened.
You can’t just have your characters announce how they feel! That makes me feel angry!
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