Disney Pixar Discussion

Post by **askmike1** » January 27th, 2006, 4:12 pm

James wrote:If you think The Incredibles was nothing more than a "superhero" movie, then I think you missed the point.

I honestly don't think of it any more than just a superhero movie. People falling off buildings, the villain tricking the hero, the superhero's friends being used as bait, an overly predictive ending, etc, etc, etc. To me it is just a superhero movie.

Post by **James** » January 27th, 2006, 4:13 pm

Christian wrote:Any superhero comic will claim that for itself. The Incredibles is not the first superhero story to show "supers" dealing with real-life, non-superheroic situations, concerns, and relationships. It did pull it off exceptionally well but pulling it off exceptionally well doesn't make it original.

The difference is The Incredibles was NOT a film about superheros dealing with real-life, non-superheroic situations. It was about an otherwise normal family dealing with real-life, non-superheroic situations on top of just happening to be superheros.

Post by **James** » January 27th, 2006, 4:17 pm

askmike1 wrote:I honestly don't think of it any more than just a superhero movie. People falling off buildings, the villain tricking the hero, the superhero's friends being used as bait, an overly predictive ending, etc, etc, etc. To me it is just a superhero movie.

And Beauty and the Beast is just another fairy tale. Beautiful girl falls for handsome prince, yada yada yada.

Just as BatB gave the old-fashioned fairy tale some much needed depth, The Incredibles went beyond your average superhero movie by making the normal part of their life the focus of the film.

Post by **Christian** » January 27th, 2006, 4:19 pm

It was about an otherwise normal family dealing with real-life, non-superheroic situations on top of just happening to be superheros.

One and a half words: X-Men . . . and others.

To me it is just a superhero movie.

And a James Bond movie. And I like superhero movies and James Bond movies.

Even if I haven't explained it well (and I can tell I have only done a so-so job and that a better explanation could be made if I wasn't being a typical "Generation X-er" right now by surfing the 'net while at work) I still have a gut feeling the Disney classics, whatever that list might be comprised of, are going to hold up better over time than the Pixar hits, list comprised of every movie they have made, and I don't even necessarily want that to happen. I just think it will but that it can be avoided with future releases. Another way to explain it is that the Pixar films have all been set in the time (almost even the exact year) in which they were made while the Disney classics have been set in all different points in time or no time in particular. Even A Bug's Life was set in a time no earlier than 1997. Again, I might be explaining it poorly but the concept I'm struggling to present still makes a huge difference.

Post by **James** » January 27th, 2006, 4:26 pm

I understand what you're getting at, I just think you're focusing on the "time" in "timeless" too much.

Kids will always play with toys and imagine they're alive. Timeless.
Kids will always be afraid of the monster in the closet. Timeless.
Fathers will always do whatever they can for their children. Timeless.
Families will always have the same troubles to deal with (mid-life crises, worrying about your figure, too shy at school, wanting attention, etc) no mater how super they are. Timeless.

Post by **Meg** » January 27th, 2006, 4:30 pm

Just becuase a movie is set in the time period it was released doesn't mean it can't be a classic. Lots of live-action movies like King Kong were set in their current time period, but they're still classics.

Post by **Christian** » January 27th, 2006, 4:35 pm

Somehow I can't get over the inexplicable, gut feeling that it's still like comparing a really good meal at a fast food restaurant with a really good meal at a fine sit-down restaurant. You can be "really good" at any level but still be operating on a different level than another entity. I review Mexican restaurants in my county and have noticed that a particular place can be very standard and run-of-the-mill but if everybody acts like it's the place to go they are completely blinded to the fact that another place still has better food. And, even with the very real but unperceived difference, either place can still make a decent meal . . . on its own terms.

Just becuase a movie is set in the time period it was released doesn't mean it can't be a classic.

Never said that. My point was that Pixar has a very hard time shaking the current era and it could eventually be to their detriment. The fact that everything they have done has that hard-edged CGI look really kills a lot of the warmth too, in the same way that a vinyl record actually has a lot more timbre to the sound it produces than a CD does. I can handle bits and bytes (heck, I'm a web developer) but too much can be suffocating.

Post by **James** » January 27th, 2006, 4:48 pm

Maybe another problem is some people can't appreciate the history being made around them. Yes Snow White is a wonderful, classic film. But watching it today no one could honestly say that the story was really that good. And animation has only improved since then. It's classic and wonderful because we appreciate the history behind it. When something is relatively new some people can't appreciate the history of it yet. Especially younger people who haven't yet felt the steady crawl of time yet!

Post by **Christian** » January 27th, 2006, 4:49 pm

I hardly even remember Snow White. I remember The Incredibles much better.

Post by **James** » January 27th, 2006, 4:58 pm

I will add that it is nice to be around younger people who do appreciate history and don't think the latest and greatest thing is the best of all time. Too many young'uns on the web going around with no sense of history claiming "Shark Tale is the best animated film evar" with no perspective of what they are saying. It is refreshing to be around those that can appreciate the past as well.

Post by **Christian** » January 27th, 2006, 5:03 pm

I have a 74-year old neighbor who is the biggest Snow White collector of all time (people at Disney, including some of the Nine Old Men, knew him as The Snow White Man). One time when I was checking out all his Snow White stuff, or the small portion of it he could fit into his condo, I noticed he also had the junior novelization of The Incredibles laying around. Later, I believe he bought the Incredibles DVD and the Bambi DVD on the same day. It was very gratifying to see somebody his age buying two movies, one that was almost seven decades old and one that was hardly seven months old. Still, I simply can't shake the feeling that Bambi is much more of a genuine classic. My first viewing of Bambi when I was 5 (won't say when that was) was seared into my soul. When I saw The Incredibles I thought, "Hey, great movie. Should've bought some popcorn on the way in."

Post by **Dacey** » January 27th, 2006, 5:17 pm

James wrote:I will add that it is nice to be around younger people who do appreciate history and don't think the latest and greatest thing is the best of all time. Too many young'uns on the web going around with no sense of history claiming "Shark Tale is the best animated film evar" with no perspective of what they are saying. It is refreshing to be around those that can appreciate the past as well.

Hey, no need to put down the "Shark Tale" fans. "Horses for Courses", after all.

And I think that this thread has gone very off-topic by now.

Post by **Meg** » January 27th, 2006, 5:18 pm

James wrote:Maybe another problem is some people can't appreciate the history being made around them. Yes Snow White is a wonderful, classic film. But watching it today no one could honestly say that the story was really that good. And animation has only improved since then. It's classic and wonderful because we appreciate the history behind it. When something is relatively new some people can't appreciate the history of it yet. Especially younger people who haven't yet felt the steady crawl of time yet!

I think you're on to something...That makes a lot of sense.

Post by **Dacey** » January 27th, 2006, 5:23 pm

As for my last post, I'm by no means saying that I think that "Shark Tale" is the greatest animated movie of all time (though it's very underrated). I'm just saying it's a matter of opinion.

Post by **Christian** » January 27th, 2006, 5:32 pm

If you stick up for a movie in even the smallest way people will always assume you are claiming it is the greatest movie of all time.